Some things are done right and they deserve praise. A case in point is the CdA Charter Academy, which rants 544th out of the 1,300 best high schools in the nation according to an article in Newsweek Magazine, echoed in today’s CdA Press.
The Charter Academy demonstrates how education can not only work but excel. It’s government-run, but it’s emphasis is solidly on education. They don’t have the latest buildings. They don’t buy into the latest trends, but instead concentrate on good old learning. And it works.
I’m proud to be part of a community that features such an excellent and proven asset.
the charter academy should be commended for doing an excellent job and they do it with limited resources but they also get to accept only those who succeed. they do have a high attrition rate and if students don’t pass at the charter they are not allowed to stay, they leave and go to the regular public school. regular public schools don’t have that luxury.
Comment by reagan — May 24, 2008 @ 2:24 pm
Because I am suffering from a dreadful toothache, this will be short. While I agree that Charter is to be commended for its academic success, and my comments should not be construed as taking anything away from those fine students and staff; however, a number of things must be kept in mind:
1. This school is a college prep school. This means they attract kids that for the most part are headed off to college. Public schools educate kids of all abilities and interests.
2. The parents of the kids in Charter are, on the whole, MUCH more involved in their kids lives and interested in their academic success.
3. A much higher percentage of the kids at Charter come from highly functioning home lives and a far smaller percentage than public school kids, come from dysfunctional home lives.
4. Keep in mind that if you gather together students of any age that WANT to learn and that can behave, almost anyone with the requisite knowledge can teach them. However, the further away from that ideal student you get, the more talented the staff has to be and the more infrastructure is needed.
5. “Good old learning” is not nearly good enough in the world our kids will find themselves in. For example, many school districts around the nation teach keyboarding in the 2d or 3rd grade, and some are teaching keyboarding and computer software packages instead of writing long-hand. Kids are taught to print and then to type. For my own part, the only long-hand writing I do is to sign my name. This is one quick example of the kind of paradigm shift I am talking about. Kids learn more science and math younger than we did and this trend will only continue into the future. Another trend sure to continue is how advanced students can earn college credit well before leaving high school.
5. ‘For every complex problem there is a solution that is concise, clear, simple, and wrong.’– H. L. Mencken
Comment by Mark W Altman — May 24, 2008 @ 2:45 pm
Then couldn’t the Charter School concept be taken in other directions? What about a school dedicated to those who do not want to go to college, a vocational-technical school? How about a school customized to deal with students who come from dysfunctional families?
It is possible to take your comments, Mark, as a justification that our current school system, where “one size fits all,” fails miserably. I’m curious about your thoughts on addressing that issue. (And I hope you feel better, though based on the weather I don’t think you’re missing any grand outside activities!)
Comment by Dan — May 24, 2008 @ 2:50 pm
I do believe no matter how disfunctional ones family is, it is still the choice of the individual that will make a difference in their life. There are certain things that should be expected of every child. Even in the public school.
Way to go Charter!
Comment by concerned citizen — May 24, 2008 @ 3:17 pm
I have been tangentially involved in the CDA CA since Day One. It IS a “public school” Mark. It has been hated and opposed by the IEA and the CDA teachers union from Day One. The teachers all want to be there. The students almost all do as well. Those who don’t FAIL. They leave. Failure is mallowed there Mark.
You asked us for things we support — this is one we have from the start. It wins awards. It teaches. It also costs the local tax payer next to nothing for it’s facilities!
Comment by Pariah — May 24, 2008 @ 4:59 pm
pariah, the charter academy is not hated ny the teachers union; one of the unions strongest surporters is also a teacher at the academy. perhaps your involvement is more tangential than you care to admit? and how do you support it? it actually costs the taxpayers $0 for its facilities, not “next to nothing”. so how do you support it?
Comment by reagan — May 24, 2008 @ 5:46 pm
LOL reagan, sorry it won’t wash. I have seen the IEA try time and again to impose their rules on the Academy. They want it gone. BTW the facilities ARE paid for by the taxpayers, just in a very diluted way via the general fund, thus ‘next to nothing’, NOT “$0 for its facilities” as you claim.
Comment by Pariah — May 24, 2008 @ 6:18 pm
pariah, just repeating your charges without examples doesn’t make them true, could you provide some examples of how the iea tries to impose their rules on the academy. and what is the way that the academy facilities are paid for via the general fund, i am not familiar with that.
Comment by reagan — May 24, 2008 @ 7:24 pm
Dan,
Thanks for the well wishes of my tooth; it has actually calmed down a little. You are absolutely correct about a charter school being taken a number of directions, such as there could be a vo-tech charter or just about any other kind of charter school. While it might help a bit to have those charter schools, you still can’t get around the negative effects of coming from a dysfunctional household. As to a school for those who come from dysfunctional households, in some measure we have them. While not all, many of the kids who go to Project and Bridge come from what I would consider to be less than ideal households. A school that REALLY provided counseling and other services to those kids would cost a LOT of money and taxpayers would probably squeal like stuck pigs. However, in the long run the cost to society would likely be cheaper than the lost production, incarceration and the perpetuation of failed families we suffer from now.
On that note, C.C., while I agree that at some point an individual takes responsibility for their own life and what they make of it, it is very hard for me to hold a kid to that kind of accountability when they have no choice as to their surroundings. They do not choose to live w/ an abusive father or an alcoholic mom, or a parent suffering from mental or emotional problems. Even after they can leave home, being raised in a low or non-functioning household is not one of those things that you can say to someone, “Suck it up” or “Rub a little dirt on it, you’ll be ok.” It just doesn’t work that way. It usually takes years to overcome such an upbringing and for some the leap is too great, they can’t make it.
Pariah,
I realize CA is a public school, but I haven’t figured out yet how to differentiate it from “regular” public schools. However, CA has some VERY important differences from a “regular” public school. For one thing students and parents self select to be there. For another if a student can’t do the work or can’t behave, they are gone. For a regular public school that is a much less viable option. For further comment on CA, I suggest some of my comments above.
To All,
My most fervent argument is that a child can get a GREAT education in a public school. My own kids are testaments to that. However, Dawn and I are at EVERY parent-teacher night, we volunteer at the schools and our kids know our expectation as to their grades and more importantly as to their behavior. When you find a way to make every parent approach THAT standard, public schools would more than give Charter a run for its money.
Last, I do not mean for any of this to excuse public schools from their responsibility to educate kids. However, as I have mentioned in other places, schools, societies and the policies that govern them are complex adaptive systems and those do not lend themselves well to simple solutions. Please believe me that when a politician offers you a simple solution to almost ANY social ill, they are either ignorant of the challenge they are facing or they are pandering to you, believing you to be too stupid to understand the complexity of the problem. The evidence I offer for this argument can be found in the lengths of the posts I write here. I find that I must write long posts (and even then I am not writing NEARLY enough) to articulate a cogent argument. On top of that, even after a lengthy answer, the answer is often unsatisfying to any of us.
Comment by Mark W Altman — May 24, 2008 @ 7:46 pm
Pariah,
Good evening. I was just curious as to the choice of name? The definition is an interesting one considering the topics and the position we sometimes feel we are put in.
Sorry. Did not mean to get side tracked.
Anyway, have a great weekend and Memorial Day!
CC
Comment by concerned citizen — May 24, 2008 @ 7:49 pm
Mark,
I came from a back ground of parental drug abuse, alcoholism, physical abuse, verbal abuse, and sexual abuse. My mother prostituted me and my sibling out starting at the age of five until we were well into our teens. It was not until someone took me under there wing and showed me some tough love. They explained to me that MY choices were guiding me down the wrong path. It does not matter one bit what any other human being does to us, however it IS what we do with it that will determine the outcome of our future. I believe it is time for a little tough love in the public school system. instead of making excuses for the way children are and stand up for society as a whole. There are things that just should NOT be accepted or tolerated in the public school system. It all starts with the admin having a backbone and looking out for the children first.
Aswith a job, one would get fired for showing up late, not showing at all, not performing their duties, not performing their duties properly, talking on thier phone while they are supposed to be working. Well, you get the picture.
Sorry for the rambling. Hope the tooth is better. Have a great weekend and Memorial Day!
CC
Comment by concerned citizen — May 24, 2008 @ 8:18 pm
“pariah, just repeating your charges without examples doesn’t make them true,…”
And your denial means no more. Read the CDA Press. The articles have been published.
“…and what is the way that the academy facilities are paid for via the general fund, i am not familiar with that.”
Clearly. Sad really. Who do you THINK pays for the facilities of a government run school?
Comment by Pariah — May 24, 2008 @ 8:54 pm
cc – it is a name that fits. When the pretty people hear my name, they twitch. If I have been in a room, they salt the floor. Rumors that I may have an interest in a project of theirs causes real consternation. I am a pariah.
Comment by Pariah — May 24, 2008 @ 8:56 pm
Mark,
The differences between Charter and the rest of the government run schools is the reason for the success of same and the failures, mediocrities and even successes of the others. When schools exhibit the criterion you outline, success becomes very likely. The reciprocal is also true. Hence the NEA/IEA opposition.
Comment by Pariah — May 24, 2008 @ 9:01 pm
CC,
Thank you for the comfort for my tooth, it hurts on and off now. It is a real nescience. I am sorry for the challenges you faced growing up. However, my guess is the “love” part of the “tough love” you talked about was far more instrumental to your turn around than the “tough” part. Further, are you suggesting that a 5 year old, ANY 5 year old, could CHOOSE to prostitute themselves? Or that somehow after being raised in such an environment a teenager could just shrug off that kind of abuse like they might a scraped knee? I know something of resilience in human beings and that stretches the imagination.
Maslow’s hierarchy of needs suggests that learning is above safety and emotional nurturing in the hierarchy of needs and therefore learning cannot happen until those more basic needs are being met. To compare abuse and neglect and their negative effects on education, to shortcomings as an employee are to say the least comparing apples and coconuts.
Pariah,
I am not clear as to your meaning in number 14.
Comment by Mark W Altman — May 24, 2008 @ 9:19 pm
Mark,
You say (correctly):
“For one thing students and parents self select to be there. For another if a student can’t do the work or can’t behave, they are gone.”
Reread 14. Get it?
Comment by Pariah — May 24, 2008 @ 9:26 pm
Pariah,
I think I follow and if I do then here is my response. Here is where we enter into the wonderful world of complexity. It is most certainly attractive to educate the kids who wish to be in class, kicking those who are not ready to be there (for whatever reason) into the street. However, then we have scores of kids, wholly unsupervised roaming the streets getting into no shortage of trouble. The cure for that is to fine parents, throw the kids or their parents in jail or some combination of the three. Many of those parents don’t have the money to pay the fines. It may not be legal, constitutional, or morally right, to throw a parent in jail for a child’s crime so we are left with throwing the kid in jail. Now we have a larger, more immediate expense of jailing them, then an ongoing expense of trying to keep them out of a cycle of being in and out of jail, or dead end jobs the rest of their lives.
Comment by Mark W Altman — May 24, 2008 @ 9:54 pm
Mark,
You see but you do not. Parents are the cure, not the disease. Empower parents. Let them decide together with the children where the best choices are. Let government (if you must) fund these choices, but let the parents choose. The small remnant of children ‘left behind’ can then be taken to government facilities as a last resort. Choice works. State run systems do not.
Comment by Pariah — May 24, 2008 @ 9:59 pm
Pariah,
Parents have ALL the power in the world when it comes to their kids. ALL of it. What they lack is the will and education to exercise that power. I speak from direct experience, both as a parent and as someone that studies government and public policy.
The dysfunctional parents I am talking about are both the symptom and the disease. Where we are now did not arrive from a vacuum. We tried non-governmental funded schools and it didn’t work then and it darn sure won’t work in modern society.
Comment by Mark W Altman — May 24, 2008 @ 10:13 pm
“Parents have ALL the power in the world when it comes to their kids.”
The State decides what school their kids go to, what subjects get taught and what to tell them. Most parents have no clue they have choices and the economic reality for most is that they do not.
Comment by Pariah — May 24, 2008 @ 10:20 pm
pariah, you write in cryptic ways that avoid facts and specifics and makes me wonder how we can solve problems, real or imagined, if people can’t or won’t articulate concerns and solutions. i am not making denials of anything, i am asking you for examples of something you claim to be true of which i am not aware, ie. iea- charter academy conflicts and your response is read the paper? more of a deflection than an answer. if there are real problems help all of us to understand and motivate us to action, but “the articles have been published” does nothing to support your claims. likewise, “who do you think pays for the facilities” is a vague statement when what i asked for was information. obviously you are not familiar with the funding mechanism of charter schools, or you’d have answered the question instead of merely deflecting, once again. you may have valid points, but unfortunately you choose to make sweeping generalizations, that may or may not be true, but you offer nothing in the way of concrete examples or facts to support them. if you do have some actual sources of fact, i’d be interested in learning more.
Comment by reagan — May 24, 2008 @ 10:37 pm
ROTFLMAO! Sorry reagan, you are a hoot. Take the tax issue, the CA gets state funding. They have facilities. Ergo they are tax payer funded facilities.
As far as the union issues, you claimed the union has no problem with the CA, So put up. Prove it. My contentions have been reported time and again in the press. You seem to find that less than credible. Refute it. If you can.
Comment by Pariah — May 24, 2008 @ 10:42 pm
I enjoy the back and forth here, but it does help to provide links to demonstrate points. I’m talking both ways here. One of the drawbacks of this type of forum is that it’s easy to say things — even things you know to be true — and yet have someone question them. It’s better to link to a source elsewhere that backs up a point. It’s not to “win,” but to educate.
This software supports standard HTML codes. So if you have the links, please share them with us. Thanks!
Comment by Dan — May 25, 2008 @ 3:46 am
Opposition to the original legislation:
Clueless in Idaho
Comment by Pariah — May 25, 2008 @ 6:48 am
Mark,
Are you telling me that you have never had to discipline one of your children? That they could not go to a certain function? Act a certain way? I do mean “tough love”. The person I refer to was of strong moral character and got right in my face, if you will. They told me that my actions where unacceptable and yes it was my choice if they were going to continue to help me. the ball was now in my court. At some point in ones life it needs to be heard, you cannot, not should not, do this or act that way. That certain things ARE unacceptable and if you choose to do them you will be removed from a given situation. There is a problem when uacceptable behavior is condoned by teachers and the school no matter the parents beliefs or wishes. My own children tell me of ipods allowed in the classroom along with sodas on the desk, kids just walking out of class whenever they feel like it, cursing, TEACHERS cursing, dress code violations, talking back to teachers without dialogue and that is just scratching the surface. There was even a teacher selling novelty items to the kids during class time that they, the teacher, designed and patent.
Don’t get me wrong, I know there are some very good dedicated teachers out there but there are alot of bad ones that are just hanging in until retirement.
These are the things that CA stands for and if you cannot follow the rules, then you need to find another place of employement or in the case of the student, school that will accept your behavior which is what the public school is doing.
Accountability starts at the top.
Comment by concerned citizen — May 25, 2008 @ 7:43 am
dan thank you for your comments. pariah, october 1997?
Comment by reagan — May 25, 2008 @ 8:51 am